The Power Play Behind the Iran Israel War with Tom Luongo & Alex Krainer

Research chemist-turned financial and geopolitical analyst, Tom Luongo and portfolio manager/podcaster, Alex Krainer join Crypto Rich BTC’s, Chris Coverdale for a very interesting discussion about the baffling sequence of events in Iran and Israel.

When Israel’s surprise attacks on Iran began, Tom made a prediction: “In 48 hours, the world we thought that we knew will be unrecognizable,” meaning that our model of how we conceived of the world would be completely different. He was right but most people are slower on the uptake, so it’s going to take longer than 48 hours.

The podcast starts by acknowledging that everybody has a point of view that has been substantially shaped by propaganda and by gaslighting and by various cultural biases; that we’re working with imperfect information and we’re laboring under multiple layers of psychological operations, all of which is exhausting and that will cause us to get stuff wrong.

He says, “But we’ve never had a moment where Davos is losing control of the United States, and they’re on the verge of losing political control of the United States, and the IC, and all of this is all happening. They have to ratchet it up and drive us all crazy.”

Tom thinks that the world changed when Barack Obama passed the JCPOA , the “Iran Nuclear Deal” in 2015, together with the UK, France, Germany, the EU, Russia and China – from which Trump withdrew in 2018.

Tom says that the JCPOA was an investment vehicle for European/Globalist interests, represented by Obama. Their goal was to break up the International North South Transport Corridor (INSTC). He says the JCPOA also appears to have been designed to rile-up the Israelis, because it didn’t stop the Iranians from enriching uranium, which, in turn would promote the Globalists’ coveted Forever War, by Iran getting nuclear bombs.

Tom believes there may be an aspect of Israel’s attack on Iran that is revenge for being betrayed by the Europeans.

Tom sees the 10/7 Hamas attacks as the next stage of the JCPOA’s European subterfuge against the Israelis. His gut-level sense is that the attacks were an MI6 operation, saying:

“They activated Hamas to attack Israel to get them spiraling towards the enemy. It doesn’t matter who dies. Israelis die, Iranians die, they love it, because it’s trying to advance their agenda. And their agenda would be: Get Israel fully on tilt and then, in effect portray them as the Perfect Villain and Iran as the Perfect Victim…

“And the other side of the Zionist Project is now Iran…The Europeans are acting exactly as you would expect, if my argument is correct: They’re supporting Iran here, when they never supported Iran before. They turned on Israel … Before the bodies were even found in 10/7!..

“After World War II, no one was allowed to criticize Israel. They were the Perfect Victim. Our support of them hollowed-out our infrastructure. It hollowed-out our moral standing in the world. It hollowed us out, as a country. It took the United States and turned them into just another sh¡tty f@cking version of the British Empire…

“And that frustration is real. We weren’t allowed to talk about – if you had named a Jew or you said anything bad about Israel for years, decades, you would be de-platformed, thrown out, removed from polite society and everything else.

“And then, all of a sudden on 10/8, we were allowed to criticize the Jews. All of a sudden, we’re watching – I’m literally – Dexter White and I have been watching the surge in real, honest-to-God, anti-Semitism. Some of it is bots. Some of it is real.

“Those guys are not getting de-platformed, anymore. All of a sudden, Nick Fuentes has a platform, again…And [Dexter’s] like, in my ear, the entire time, ‘Something’s off. Something’s changed. This is not right.’

“So Israel went from the Perfect Victim to the Perfect Villain practically overnight. The EU and the Democrats – I think we talked about this. I said, ‘Watch,’ in 2024. I said, ‘They’re setting up this thing. They’re backing the Palestinians to try and hang Trump with his relationship with Israel. They’re going to run against him on it!’…

“And then Israel, all of a sudden becomes the Perfect Villain. And again, I’m not arguing that the Israelis are ‘good’ here. They’re not the good guys.

“I’m working from that classic story triad of Hero-Victim-Villain. Depending on your point of view and depending on who you are, every player has aspects of that role…

“If, in the existential moment, Israel has to choose sides, after they’ve been betrayed by the people who put them in the position that they’re in, even a guy like Netanyahu, at that moment may have to say, ‘You know what? Davos is weak! All of their promises don’t matter!’

“If they betrayed Israel – their project – in order to start this process, where we are today, then I can see a master psychopath politician like Netanyahu throwing in with Trump.

“The proof of that argument – and we don’t have that proof, yet – and I’m not saying that that argument is correct. I’m not saying anything. What I’m saying is the proof of that argument is if we do not see him push for regime change, along with Trump, and if everybody else pushes for regime change…

Monaco-based Alex Krainer, having been born and raised in Communist Yugoslavia and never having lived in the US has very different biases from Tom Luongo but he’s mainly agreement with him and he offers a lot of insight about the role of British Intelligence in Qatar and how 10/7 may have been carried-out.

Where Alex vehemently diverges is in his belief that Iran has done absolutely nothing wrong and that they should be allowed to have a nuclear deterrence and he completely disagrees with any talk about Israel becoming the “Fall Guy”, saying:

“Israel is strictly British Empire’s beachhead in the Middle East, there to keep the region destabilized perpetually, and doing their job to a tee. Absolutely perfectly…

“I understand why Trump backed out of the JCPOA, because he looked at the deal, and he was like, ‘What the Hell? We clean this up, we negotiate, we police it, and these European degenerates take the spoils? No deal!’”

It’s a very spirited and engaging conversation, fully transcribed below.

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TRANSCRIPT

OPENING MONTAGE

Alex Krainer: I’m perplexed as Hell about Trump’s conduct, which seems completely insane. In fact, it seems so completely insane. Irredeemably, way out there, ‘One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest Insane’, That, I can’t even believe that somebody could be that insane.

Tom Luongo: I think we’ve all been propagandized by the Russians, by the Iranians, by the Israelis, by the British, by the French, by the Americans, by the Neocons – by everybody. Our view of what this conflict is actually about has been polluted with all of that gaslighting propaganda.

The scenario is now starting to look like they want to install Davos’s preferred guy in Iran, which is the return of the Shah. They are betraying their own people, as well as everybody else. That’s a harder narrative to accept, but it may actually be true, because it actually furthers their f@cking evil goddamn plans.

Alex Krainer: So Iran is in the right to defend themselves, because maybe they will become like the Congolese. They’re going to become slaves to the Western Empire.

And the Brits and the French are dead set on regaining their colonial dominance over the Middle East, over Africa, over South Asia. They want Russia, they want Ukraine, they want Eastern Europe, they want the South America, all of it.

(Commercial break)

FULL TRANSCRIPT

Chris Coverdale: There’s too much going on. Take it away.

Tom Luongo: Alex, you start, man. I’ve been waiting to hear your take on what you think is going on for days, now.

Alex Krainer: Hi, Rich. Hi, Tom. Good to join you guys today. Lots to talk about, isn’t it? Well, I would start with a question. And I’ll start with a question for Tom Luongo, because I expect that you will have a better insight into this.

But I’m perplexed as Hell about Trump’s conduct, which seems completely insane. In fact, it seems so completely insane, irredeemably, way-out-there, ‘One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest’ insane, that I can’t even believe that somebody could be that insane.

So, I’m thinking he’s doing something. And I can’t figure out what he’s doing. But I have like a hunch. And so the Big Beautiful Bill is meant to go through to Congress, what? On the 4th of July or just before, on the 3rd of July? Is that is that correct?

Tom Luongo: I think so. Yeah.

Alex Krainer: Yeah. Do you think that he’s playing the “I’m an Über Zionist” game to get that bill passed? And then, he’s going to do a 360º or maybe a 180º?

Tom Luongo: I think that’s part of it. I’m not gonna argue. Thursday night, I was on the phone with Larry Johnson while the attack, the initial attack was going on; was on the phone with Larry for two hours after he’s just gotten off the plane from Moscow, where he talked to Lavrov, and he talked to some of the people and whatnot.

And at that point, Larry was stunned. And I was stunned. And that was Thursday night.

And we were all, like really freaked-out. I know that I’m sure you guys saw the tweet that I put out Thursday night which said, “In 48 hours, the world we thought that we knew is would be unrecognizable.”

And I did not mean nuclear weapons. I never meant that, at all. I meant our idea a conception about how the our model about what we thought about the world would be completely different. And I and I said it and I wrote it, right at a moment where I was having the hardest time trying to reconcile, figure out where things were going to go from here, because they could easily spiral in 100 different directions.

And I didn’t have a and I didn’t have a handle, at all on what was going on. That was Thursday night. And then Friday morning, I saw a note that said, Lindsey Graham had just let the Big Beautiful Bill out of Committee, where he was holding up both ICE funding and Border Security.

I’m like, “OK, that’s piece number one.” That was important. Trump does have a traitorous faction in the Senate.

What I’ve come to realize or what I’ve come to – this is my current version of the way I think things work – and I’m going with what I’m about to say is going is trouble. I know, I know, Rich, you’ve heard part of this.

The problem is, Alex, you haven’t heard any of this yet. So because you’ve been as busy as everybody else has, which is: I believe that Netanyahu is – nothing I’m about to say is going to say that my attitude towards Israel has changed, which is, I think it’s – I hate them. I always have. OK. I hate what they’ve done in Gaza. I hate…how they’ve treated the United States – they treated everybody. And mostly I’ve hated how the Israeli government has treated the Israeli people.

Remember that my fundamental grant, my fundamental argument has always been that there’s a framework of potential for grand bargain in the Middle East. And it’s Trump and Putin that are the key players in this. And…they are beset on all sides by people attempting to make them do things that they do not want to do.

So I don’t think Trump is lying, that he doesn’t want Iran to have a nuclear weapon, because I don’t think he wants anybody to have a nuclear weapon. I think Netanyahu doesn’t want Iran to have a nuclear weapon. And I think they have different reasons as to why they might not want Iran to have a nuclear weapon.

The big question is who holds whose leash?

And if you listen to all of the people that are out in force in every venue, at a level that I have not seen since the propaganda started on 10/8 before Israel even responded to 10/7, what do I see?

That “Trump has betrayed MAGA”, that Trump has done this. Larry Johnson was screaming at me that Trump could have stopped this, if he wanted to.

But I’m like, “Yeah, he could have. So maybe there’s a reason why he didn’t?”

And it’s not just about domestic politics. It’s about that this just needs to happen, that this is the precursor. This is the first thing that has to happen, in order to start the process towards a Grand Bargain in the Middle East.

So now that I’ve said that, I’m going to tell you what my preferred outcome is. And I think once I say it, Alex, you’re going to be like, “OK, Tom hasn’t lost his mind.”

I’m hoping for a tie and a lot of injuries; meaning I want Iran to be punched in the mouth an awful lot, and I want the Israelis to be punched in the mouth an awful lot. And then I want them to both go, “Oh, yeah, we can’t do this anymore.”

They are both, I think – and I still think – they are both pawns in a much larger game. And the question is, who maps to whom?

And one of the things that I’ve been considering, and the more I study this, I really start to think about this. And no matter what you might think about Israel, they may be the only ones here who can actually do what needs to be done.

I think we’ve all been propagandized by the Russians, by the Iranians, by the Israelis, by the British, by the French, by the Americans, by the Neocons – by everybody. And our view of what this conflict is actually about has been polluted with all of that gaslighting and propaganda.

Because of that, some of us, including myself, have missed the mark, at times. So what I’m about to say is probably going to rankle a lot of people, but the more I’ve had a chance to present this argument, the more sense it makes to me, which is that: The world changed when Obama got the JCPOA signed.

And what I mean by that is the history of Israel’s relationship with the United States and Britain and Europe was one thing. And you and I, Alex, have done unbelievable work, over the years to explain that story: The Balfour Declaration, Sykes-Picot, this, that, World War I, World War II, all of this stuff. Everything has happened.

Except that here’s the problem: What’s the British MO? Have people on both sides of the fight, create an open wound, and then betray one of them, at a particular moment, and then set the dominoes toppling after that?

Obama argued for the JCPOA and lied about it, about what he was doing and how he was negotiating it for five years, the entire time it was being negotiated. He lied about it, openly lied about it, until he got what he wanted.

So, I think at a certain level, you could make the argument that the JCPOA was designed to set the Israelis on tilt, because it didn’t really stop the Iranians from enriching. And I know that Netanyahu’s been screaming that the “Iranians are five minutes away from a nuclear weapon!” for 30 years. I know that...

“And you cry wolf enough times that people stop believing it. And Netanyahu, when Israel was the big Zionist Project – and it’s still the Zionist Project, by the way – but it’s being betrayed.

And the other side of the Zionist Project is now Iran. Because, if you look at how everybody has responded, since Israel took this step, Germany and France and Kayakalis and all of them are trying to get involved in the negotiations. The British – and the scenario is now starting to look like they want to install Davos’ preferred guy in Iran, which is the return of the Shah.

Iran is now, I just saw something…which said, “Iran backs Pahlavi coming in,” that the Iranian government backs Pahlavi or the IRGC or somebody. Now we’ve got Iran, now we got Iranian factions backing this play.

Alex Krainer: Factions? Which factions, Tom?

Tom Luongo: I think it was the, I think it was the, hold on, let me find it. Am I seeing some code factions, I bet? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Hold on.

Alex Krainer: Where is it? You gotta be careful with that.

Tom Luongo: Iranian Supreme Leader hands over power after decapitation to Iran’s military, to the IRGC. That’s part of it. There was something else I saw this morning. People have been sending me stuff in like 18 different, 18 different places and I don’t have.

Alex Krainer: Yeah, there’s a, there’s a lot of PSYOP, there’s a lot of PSYOP that doesn’t make any sense, at all that, that, story’s got –

Tom Luongo: Right. What I’m getting at, here is that this may have been the – OK – and I’m going to, I’m going to back up and just like, let’s put the cards on the table: Putin, Trump, Netanyahu, Davos, all of these people, they’re all mob bosses.

Right. But…here’s the interesting part about mob bosses is that within the mob, they have a strict code of honor, meaning don’t betray. “Here’s your area of where you get to do this. Here’s your area where you get to do this.” As long as you don’t betray each other, we’re all good. Right? If not, it turns into a Scorsese movie and then, there’s a lot of blood.

Now, in the model I just laid-out in theory, because look, JCPOA, then 10/7, you and I have done a hundred podcasts together since, or at least 30 podcasts, 40 podcasts together, since 10/7. And I’ve really thought, you know, I’ve tried to be thoughtful about that scenario.

My initial reaction to it, gut-level reaction was that it was an MI6 operation. That was my gut level reaction: MI6. They activated Hamas to attack Israel to get them spiraling towards the enemy.

I sat there thinking, “Oh, it could be this one, it could be that one.” I wanted to be thorough in my, and skeptical in all of my analysis, in case of all of these PSYOPs that were out there and all the information.

And I was, and I, so I said, “You know what I’m going to do? I’m going to stay in the middle. I’m not going to back the Palestinians. I’m not going to back the Israelis. I’m going to decry the human loss that the Israelis are doing, because I can’t stand any of that.”

But at the end of the day, how do you square any of this violence? We all don’t want the violence, right? So we always keep everything at the strategic player level and knowing full well that the people who have set up all these conflicts, they don’t give a f@ck about any of us. They hate people. They’ll use whoever they have to.

They’re just, they’re allowing Russians to slaughter Ukrainians and Ukrainians to blow up the Moscow Opera House and all this stuff, right? All these horrible things that we’ve been dealing with. And they love it. They get off on it.

It doesn’t matter who dies. Israelis die, Iranians die, they love it because it’s trying to advance their agenda. And their agenda would be: Get Israel fully on tilt and then, in effect portray them as the perfect villain and Iran as the perfect victim.

Alex Krainer: Sorry, Tom, “on tilt”? I don’t understand that phrase.

Tom Luongo: “On tilt” is a poker term for getting a guy acting emotionally at the table, right?…If you get a guy on tilt and he’ll make bad bets, he’ll make bad bets, you can steal his money from him. That’s poker table.

“On tilt”, meaning “Get him riled-up, get them emotional and abreacting, get them crazy and freaking-out.”

And what’s Davos been doing to Putin, attempting to get him on tilt for three years. They keep walking up the escalatory ladder, right?

So it pains me to say this, because I effing hate Netanyahu, but this might have been the right play. Let him go and do what he always wanted to do.

And Trump sits back and goes, “Look, you want to do this? I can’t stop it.” Because, at some point you have to turn to the Iranians and say – because, how have the Iranians have been negotiating over this nuclear deal?

There’s a number of ways of looking at this. It could be that Trump and the Iranians had a deal and that Bibi blew it up by attacking. That’s a perfectly rational explanation, right? That he cut a deal that the Israelis couldn’t live with. “Nuts to Trump, I’m going unilateral!”

Of course, we know that Trump doesn’t mind that, because he wants the Iranians not to have a nuclear weapon. So, he set a deadline, 60 days. On day 61, he said, “OK, Bibi, you’re going.”

He also told the Iranians, in the generous version of this, that, “Hey, you guys have 60 days. I can’t hold him back any longer than this. This is it!”

And since they negotiate the same way that Zelensky negotiates – which is to not negotiate, at all and extend to pretend, everything else, but who does that? Who negotiates like that?!

This is what starts to really like, oh my God! Don’t make me have sympathy for Netanyahu, you motherf@ckers! But this is where we are. Because I think they’ve been playing both sides against the f@cking middle.

And they’re now empowering the Neocons to go crazy and scream, “See, this is the right thing to do!” All the spiral towards endgame.

Alex Krainer: And the endgame being?

Tom Luongo: To get Trump involved in a war physically with the Iranians, in such a way that he can’t get out of it and to destroy his attempt to remake the United States.

Because the goal has always been bond markets, collateral, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And they don’t care how they get there.

The Russians’ response, so far fits that model, which is: “We don’t want the Iranians to have a nuclear weapon, either. So please, come to the table and negotiate. Let’s neuter Israel.”

Now, when I think this all the way through to the end, what I get is, “OK, Trump’s going to keep sitting back, if the Iranians have any weaponry left. And we’re finding out right now. Cool. Bomb the crap out of each other. Let’s come to the table.”

Chris Coverdale: Alright, Tom.

Tom Luongo: That’s a shortened version of this. I got a three-hour version of this rant, Alex, and I don’t want to hog the whole thing, but I’m trying to lay the basic framework, because I want you to understand and I’m trying to do this in such a way that it’s both maybe the only way through this and unbelievably frustrating, all at the same time.

Chris Coverdale: And then, something that you have said elsewhere, Tom, that I’ve heard is that Trump and Putin, the “Grand Bargain”, as you referred to, is that Iran and Israel, they punch each other out, seriously weaken each other. So Trump and Putin just sit back while they just keep lobbing missiles, destroying each other’s country and their strength.

OK, and then that allows the Russians and the Americans to exit from that region, without the British coming in, because the British and the Europeans, who are backing Iran and Israel, controlling both, have had their proxies—

Tom Luongo: – Or had backed both of them and then betrayed the Israelis, in order to get them to attack Iran. And they win, if they can get Trump and they can blame it all on Trump, which is what they’re doing.

Chris Coverdale: Yeah. OK. So then, if both lose and the Europeans and the British, they’re out of there, they don’t have these major proxies. The thing that I don’t get…October the 7th, right? Yes, I can get MI6 behind Hamas, because they do perfectly everywhere, right? But that was a false flag.

Unless MI6 were also telling Israel not to respond for seven hours and to drop the security on probably the most secure border in the world.

Tom Luongo: Exactly. And maybe that’s exactly why the Israelis are so goddamn pissed-off. Maybe, and again, who are they really pissed off at? I don’t know, man. I don’t want to – at a certain point, Hamas did kill a lot of people. And there comes a point where maybe it’s just that simple.

And what Dexter White was saying is maybe this is just revenge for 10/7. I’m like, “No, I think it’s a revenge for being betrayed by the people who they thought were their benefactors.”

Ooh, that’s an even bigger story! I mean, again, I’m happy to see pushback on this. I’m happy to like – because, it’s evolving in real time.

Alex Krainer: The false flag scenario is not complicated, even on October 7, because you had a significant part of the Hamas leadership who were actually living High Life in Qatar, and who were billionaires flying around on a private jet.

And what is Qatar in this situation? Qatar is the second Cat’s Paw of the British in that region. Qatar has very extensive intelligence ties with the British, with MI6, with British Foreign Office, to the extent that they even have a military, it’s not an alliance, but it’s a very extensive partnership, so much so that the Qataris are the, I think, the only country in the world that have two military bases in the UK at their disposal, where they have joint training on British jets.

And so Qatar is full of British intel officers. They coordinate action. And then, you know, Lo! and behold! Qatar is financing Hamas and has the core group of Hamas leaders, right there in Qatar. So, it would have been easy to arrange a false flag in Israel, so that on the one hand, Hamas activates a cell in Gaza to launch an attack. And then, on the other side, the Israelis arrange that they leave a soft target for the Hamas operatives.

So you have to keep in mind that there’s two different Hamases. One is, you know, the High Life Playboys in Qatar. And then you have like the real deal freedom fighters, the Jedis in Gaza, OK?

I think that the real-deal Freedom Fighters in Gaza were the ones who took action and who had no intention of killing any innocent civilians. They had the intention of grabbing as many hostages as possible, because their objective was to exchange them against tens of thousands of Palestinians that were being held indefinitely on no charges, raped and tortured and starved to death in Israeli prisons. OK, so that was their objective.

Civilian casualties happened either by accident, or because the, you know, the Qatar Hamas, somebody was instructed, “Make sure there’s plenty of civilian casualties.”

Chris Coverdale: And the Israelis, as well.

Alex Krainer: But then, yeah, but then also, you have to keep in mind that probably close to half of all the civilian casualties were actually killed by the Israelis.

And there’s a there’s a small detail that emerged from October 7, to me, stinks to high heaven. And it’s this one: There was an incident, where the Hamas fighters had a group of Israeli hostages in a house, and they got surrounded by the Israeli forces. And there was a there were two survivors from this: one Israeli woman, and one supposedly Hamas fighter.

So what happened? This Israeli woman gave a testimony. And she said, “Oh, you know, this Hamas fighter who was there with us, he saw that there was no way out. So he he changed his clothes.”

Right. And then he and this woman escaped to the other side. Supposedly, he surrendered. Right?

Well, I don’t think it works that way. You know, we would have heard of him, we would have heard about him. We would have heard testimonies, he just disappears from the story, which tells me that he was probably working for the Israelis and probably he was one of the ones whose job it was to make sure that there’s plenty civilian casualties.

And so, after this woman and that supposed Hamas fighter escape, then the Israelis shoot a tank shell into that house, and they kill everybody inside.

So you know, that was part of that game and you know, what I’ve found, in many places throughout history, that the way you get a war going, you create one or two mass-casualty events.

So what usually happens is like, let’s say you have two peoples living side by side. Like we have in Bosnia, you know, Serbs, Croats and Muslims.

And if you go and ask people there today, they will tell you “No way there’s not going to be any war, here. Nobody wants to go to war. Nobody wants to hate their neighbors and blah, blah, blah.”

So what you do is you get a gang of thugs of one side to go to the other people’s village to kill a bunch of innocent people, rape some women and to make it so that it’s very visible, so that the media pick up on it. And usually, there’s going to be – by chance, some British UN peacekeepers there or British Special Forces, you know, who merely intended to ensure peace and stability in the region – but somehow they’re always there.

And then you know, that’s going to create a that’s going to create a scandal. And if the war doesn’t get going quite yet, you know, you have to kickstart a bit harder. And so then you get a bunch of thugs from the from the victim side of this first massacre. And you kind of get them to go to the other side, and to commit a bigger massacre.

And then, you have a rapid polarization of the communities. And then, you know, there’s no talk… You know, “They’re killing us, look what they’ve done to us! We go to war!”

It’s the jar-shaking, you know, red ants and black ants, then, and then some asshole shakes up the jar. That’s what happens.

And so what happened on October 7, in Israel, was a typical jar-shaking exercise, where, you know, the idea of picking up hostages to exchange them for Palestinian prisoners would have motivated a lot of those Jedi Hamas people but the people who orchestrated were the, you know, High Life playboy from Qatar Hamas people.

And obviously, you know, if if the thing was coordinated in Israel, and it was coordinated in Qatar, obviously, there was a node higher up the food chain that coordinated that.

And I don’t know who that might have been. Might have been the Nigerians or the Japanese. Or, you know, who knows? The Inuit from from Greenland?

Chris Coverdale: Yes. Or the Malawians.

Alex Krainer: We might never know.

Tom Luongo: They were Maori! (Everybody laughs). They were doing the Haka…

Alex Krainer: But it might have been, you know, as crazy as that sounds, it might have been the British and their MI6. So that’s as far as the the false flag thing goes. And I’m absolutely 100% convinced it was a false flag, because in the immediate aftermath of 7 October, you had at least about half a dozen of testimonies from Israeli soldiers and army veterans and intelligence service veterans, who said, “No way, no. How could this ever have happened by mistake by accident?”

It was it was just, you know, it was like a massively unlikely series of lapses, absent which, this attack would never have been possible to execute. Right. So obviously, it was a false flag attack.

Now, my interpretation of the situation in the Middle East is a little bit different than than your stone. And it’s maybe it’s a little bit simpler as well.

I don’t think you know, I wouldn’t agree that Iran deserves to be punched in the face because Iran has done nothing wrong. They are fully within their right to develop their nuclear program. They have a very strong reason to give the region, you know, to make themselves a nuclear threshold state, because their objective is to make the region nuclear-free.

So they say, “OK, if we’re going to commit to not having nuclear weapons, which we don’t want to have,” I mean, they’ve been super explicit about that they don’t want to have nuclear weapons, “But we want Israel to get rid of their nuclear stockpile as well.”

In that case, they’re fully in the right to want to be in that negotiating position. And for the rest of it for the rest of their program, program, they’re within the international law.

So, I don’t see what’s the basis for Trump to allow this not allow this to force them to negotiate to give them 60 days or 90 days or however many days – he’s completely – and then let’s not forget Israel, the Iranians have been negotiating in good faith with the West for how long? For about forever? 12 years?

Tom Luongo: See, I’m not. See, that’s the part of this I can’t go with, anymore, Alex, I really can’t. There’s a certain side of this, where I understand Iran’s position and I have absolutely no problem with what you just laid-out, up until that point, I have no problem with.

I agree, Israel should be forced in some way to become part of the NPT [Non-Proliferation Treaty], to become a normal country, like everybody else, along with India and Pakistan, who are also nuclear states that don’t have that have not signed on to the NPT. And there’s somebody else, as well. We don’t want any more of this. I agree. I want and I think the Russians want this, as well. And the I think everybody wants this.

But how are you going to get there? And…there comes a point, where you have to look at what who wants the who wants the war? And so is Trump saying, “Look, if this is the way you want to play this, this is fine. But I can’t stop the this.”

Alex Krainer: OK, you know, why doesn’t anybody ever?

Tom Luongo: But we are at the point now, even if yeah, I know. But here’s the thing. If the IAEA report is even remotely correct – and the numbers are staggering, how much nuclear fuel the Iranians have – at 60% and higher.

And one of the things about this is; this is something that became obvious to me recently. I was like, is this: 60% uranium and then to 90% fissile material is the easy part.

Normally, in a chemical reaction, trying to get higher purity gets harder, the higher you go up the yield curve, right?

And in the organic chemistry process, for example, getting 60% yield on an unoptimized organic synthesis process is easy. I can do it. I mean, that’s how we passed or failed Organic Chemistry 1 Laboratory, as undergraduates. You’ve got less than 60% on this nylon, the simple nylon reaction? You’re an idiot. You don’t know how to control temperature.

Getting to 90% is the hard part. And that’s when the chemical engineers come in and they make the whole thing work better and then just, you know, and then past a certain point, there’s no ROI on going past 90% yield. It’s cheaper just to clean it up and send it out the door than it is trying to get to 95%.

In nuclear enrichment, beyond 60%…from 60 to 90 is the easy part. Getting to 60 is the hard part. So once you’re at 60, then Netanyahu is not really lying when he says, “They can go from here to there very quickly.”

This is the thing about lies and about propaganda is that every lie has a good nugget of truth in it.

Alex Krainer: Tom, hold on. You do understand strategic requirement for deterrence.

Tom Luongo: Yes, I do. I agree. I’m not arguing that Israelis have already done all this. The French and the British have given them the technology to have nuclear missiles, with which they can completely destroy Iran.

Alex Krainer: Why is Iran not entitled to a deterrence? We have seen what happened to Libya, when they gave up their deterrence. We’ve seen what happened to Syria, to Iraq. You don’t have deterrence. You’re screwed. You’re f@cked. And you’re done.

So do you understand why Iran might want to do that? Israel gives up their nuclear. And then take into consideration: Iran has never attacked anybody since 1740s. How many countries have Israel attacked? Israel hasn’t stopped attacking everybody in their neighborhood, since they came into existence. All they do is killing.

Tom Luongo: Iran doesn’t attack anybody directly. What do you think the “Axis of Resistance” is? What do you think?

Alex Krainer: Again. Wait, but if you’re a target of a colonial project, are you not entitled to resistance? Do you just sit there and wait for them to come for you? They came for Libya. They came for Syria. They came for Somalia. They came for Sudan.

Tom Luongo: Why did Putin pull out of Syria? This is important.

Alex Krainer: Why did Putin pull out of Syria?

Tom Luongo: He did. He let Syria fall.

Alex Krainer: I’m asking why.

Tom Luongo: Oh, it was obviously, because his need to be in Syria anymore was unnecessary. I need you to think.

Alex Krainer: But he’s still there. He didn’t pull out.

Tom Luongo: He’s still there. He’s on the other side of the Tigris. He’s not backing the Assad regime, anymore. Why is he not backing Assad? Why is Turkey involved? Why is Turkey in Syria? Why are HDS and Turkey in Syria?

Alex Krainer: Because Turkey has been cultivating HDS, together with MI6 since 2012. They’ve been planning to do this, ever since their first try, between 2011 and 2016 failed, thanks to the Russians. Then, they’ve been putting together Al-Nusra and all of those.

Tom Luongo: So the JCPOA, which was designed from the ground-up to allow Europe – go look at the investment chart of what was put on the table after the JCPOA was put in place. Go look at the money that was put on the table. It’s all European money investing in Iran, every bit of it.

Alex Krainer: Oh, yeah, fine. OK.

Tom Luongo: Well, that’s Shell. And again, now we’re talking about collateral. Now we’re going back to the big game that you and I have always agreed about and what this is about.

Again, who’s the real colonial power here? Who’s going to win? What’s their goal? Their goal is to break up the International North South Transport Corridor (INSTC).

What have I said forever? The Russians don’t care who’s in charge in Iran, as long as the INSTC is secured and trade routes are secured. My argument, now is that Iran getting the nuclear bomb is the Forever War. That’s my argument.

This is not the Zionists. The Zionists clearly want all of this. What I’m arguing, now is that this goes away and then Israel has no goddamn standing left in the world, to be able…to act the way they have been acting.

The Axis of Resistance is gone. It’s been destroyed. Hezbollah stood down on Thursday. The Russians stood down. The Houthis have fired one rocket at Tel Aviv. One. These are the facts, since we’ve been here.

They’re all fit with the Saudis and everybody else around the region helping the Israelis defend themselves against Iran. I get some of the old arguments. I get some of the old relationships. I’m not arguing against them. I’m trying to think of a way to understand the frame of the situation, as it exists, right now, because none of it makes any f@cking sense other than what’s happening now is ending the permanent open wound, which is Israel versus Iran.

Alex Krainer: Wait, but Tom, if the Iranians say, “Look, we will commit to never develop a nuclear weapon, and we will limit our uranium enrichment to 3.7%, provided that Israel gives up their nuclear weapons,

Tom Luongo: – which is exactly what they just put on the table officially about an hour ago.

Alex Krainer: It’s not the first time, Tom, but why doesn’t anybody take them up on that offer? Why doesn’t anybody turn to Israel and say, “Hey Netanyahu, how about it? Let’s do this, and then we can have peace in the region.”

Nobody even thinks about this. It’s all about taking down the Iranian Regime. That’s it. Otherwise, you could completely end this whole, “Saddam has weapons of mass destruction” over “Iranian weapons of mass destruction,” if you just accepted Iran’s offer and then, turn to the Israelis and say, “Look, you guys give up your nuclear weapons, and we’re done. This problem is solved.”

Tom Luongo: This is why I’m not sold on the generous read on Netanyahu, because I think that that is exactly the thing.

Nobody in Europe, in Davos, wants this to end. They want this conflict, Alex, is what I’m arguing. What Trump is trying to do is thread the needle between both of these holes.

He’s got political problems at home that he doesn’t have control over his own Senate. He’s got a civil war. They’re trying to blow-up a civil war in LA, over ICE. They’ve got cartels and the fentanyl and all of this sh!t. You’ve got multiple attacks on our f@cking Treasury market in the last two months.

He’s trying to remake the way world – we’re trying to get rid of the British central banking system in the United States, by fundamentally changing the money flow; to fund the Government through tariffs and all of that, as opposed to debt and Income Taxes.

Someone’s stoking this conflict. Now, the simple math is that Netanyahu, as a Zionist Likudnik, has always been on the one side, refusing to take Iran’s offer up, which tracks with the history.

On the other side, why is Iran lying about how much they’re pushing towards how many hundreds of kilograms of 60% material they have, until the IAEA [International Atomic Energy Agency] finally came out and just said (crosstalk; inaudible) – and they’re on Israel’s side!

Alex Krainer: – you’re assuming that the IAEA is telling the truth?

Tom Luongo: I think, for once, they actually are, this time. We took their word for it in 2015 about the JCPOA and 2018 about the JCPOA. We took their word for it. Everybody took their word for it, back then.

Oh, by the way, the thing that’s really p¡ssing me off – and don’t get me wrong – I’m not angry with you. This is the whole thing: We’re watching an immense IC operation from within the American IC operation going after Tulsi Gabbard, trying to get her out as DNI, because she’s actually dismantling these people!

They’re going after her, which is a clear coup against Trump. This is all happening at the same time, and the Europeans are acting exactly as you would expect, if my argument is correct: They’re supporting Iran here, when they never supported Iran before.

They turned on Israel the minute Israel … Before the bodies were even found in 10/7! These people had already acted their anti-Israeli … They turned on the Israelis.

Alex Krainer: Who’s supporting Iran?

Tom Luongo: The Europeans! The Europeans are clearly trying to insert themselves into the negotiations. They were behind the JCPOA. Obama worked for them!

Alex Krainer: I don’t dispute any of that, Tom. I completely agree with that. I don’t dispute Trump being between a rock and a hard place. I don’t dispute the fact that this probably needed to happen. What I do dispute is that Iran has done actually anything wrong, at all. Like, nothing whatsoever! Because, if you are Iran, you are at the receiving end of the Empire trying to turn you into a colony.

Tom Luongo: I think that’s true. I quite agree.

Alex Krainer: You know, this whole thing about the nuclear weapons, this whole thing, Tom, it’s like practically play-for-play, exactly the same thing as Saddam’s “Weapon of Mass Destruction”. I mean, we’ve been through the whole thing. We argued endlessly about the biological, mobile biological labs and this and that.

Tom Luongo: Nobody ever believed that. I didn’t believe that sh¡t, then.

Alex Krainer: The game was always about taking –

Tom Luongo: Correct, but Alex, notice the shift in American sentiment. If you ask the Americans very specific questions, they give you very specific answers: Should Iran get a nuclear weapon? 85% No. Should the United States get involved in a war against Iran to stop them? No.

What I’m getting at is that this is another aspect of that argument I’ve always made about how Davos only has so much time to pull these things off; that their assets in the United States government, that the world is turning against them.

They are ratcheting-up the pressure, and getting us fighting about and using “historical precedent”, where they’ve bamboozled us in the past, when the United States was fully in control by Globalist forces, back in 2003, when the Rumsfeld-Cheney crowd was aligned to the entire world, because they still hadn’t done their operation in Syria. They still hadn’t overthrown Qaddafi, all of that stuff.

What I’m getting at, here is that, and this was hard for me. I could have easily stayed in the framework you’re in, right now, because it’s a very good framework. It’s, I think, even 90% accurate. I truly am with you on all that.

And I was in that mindset for many, many years. It’s one of the reasons why I became an American Dissident, complaining about my country, being willing to be sympathetic to the Russians and the Iranians – and even, to a lesser extent, the Chinese – which, I’m done with that.

But we’ve never had a moment where Davos is losing control of the United States, and they’re on the verge of losing political control of the United States, and the IC, and all of this is all happening.

They have to ratchet it up and drive us all crazy. One of the things, the way I put this the other day, is it was very easy to create the post-10/7 psychological milieu.

Give me just two minutes. I think it’ll be clear, where I’m going with this:

After World War II, no one was allowed to criticize Israel. They were the Perfect Victim. Our support of them hollowed-out our infrastructure. It hollowed-out our moral standing in the world. It hollowed us out, as a country. It took the United States and turned them into just another sh¡tty f@cking version of the British Empire — except that our language is more guttural. We’re not quite as civil and all that.

And that frustration is real. We weren’t allowed to talk about – if you had named a Jew or you said anything bad about Israel for years, decades, you would be de-platformed, thrown out, removed from polite society and everything else.

And then, all of a sudden on 10/8, we were allowed to criticize the Jews. All of a sudden, we’re watching—I’m literally – Dexter White and I have been watching the surge in real, honest-to-God, anti-Semitism. Some of it is bots. Some of it is real.

Those guys are not getting de-platformed, anymore. All of a sudden, Nick Fuentes has a platform, again. And all these people – Dexter, himself has a very sophisticated Twitter strategy to monitor these people. He’s been doing it for a decade. It’s one of his things.

And he’s like, in my ear, the entire time, “Something’s off. Something’s changed. This is not right.”

So Israel went from the Perfect Victim to the Perfect Villain practically overnight. The EU and the Democrats—I think we talked about this. I said, “Watch,” in 2024. I said, “They’re setting up this thing. They’re backing the Palestinians to try and hang Trump with his relationship with Israel. They’re going to run against him on it!”

I was so immensely surprised they never used it during the campaign. Well, they tried to kill him and they knew that that wouldn’t work because, at that point, Trump had become unstoppable. That’s why they tried to kill him, because they knew they couldn’t stop him on that front, anymore.

So it was like, “OK, here we are with that. And then Israel, all of a sudden becomes the Perfect Villain. And again, I’m not arguing that the Israelis are “good”, here. They’re not the good guys.

I’m working from that classic story triad of Hero-Victim-Villain. Depending on your point of view and depending on who you are, every player has aspects of that role.

And I’ve been really thinking this through. But it’s the way I operate about the Fed. The Fed is the Villain, from one perspective. It’s the Victim from another perspective. And it’s possibly the Hero, from another perspective.

I’m just trying to do that, now with Israel, which I’ve never been willing to do, before. And I’m trying to do that honestly.

I’m also doing this with Iran. So I’ve always had sympathy for Iran’s position, as you so eloquently pointed out and all of your points are well-taken. And I’ve had that position in the past.

But now, I have to ask the question, “Whose purpose does this conflict serve, ultimately? In the context of where we are now? Why is somebody trying to push us to World War 3?”

And we know it’s not Donald Trump. So now, what’s going –

Alex Krainer: – I agree entirely.

Tom Luongo: So now, go back to the modus operandi of the people that we know are the major players, here.

What did they do to the Turks and the Russians at Gallipoli? What did they do to this one and that one?

How did they betray the United States, in getting us involved in Vietnam over the USS Liberty? All these things that we’ve gone through over the years.

I really do believe, now, in retrospect, especially the more I’ve dug into how Obama used the JCPOA to do Davos’ bidding…and he lied about it – openly lied to Congress about it!

I read an article from Jack Haschel the other day, yesterday, about this. I don’t agree with his point of view, but his facts and the timeline really line up with everything I’ve ever thought about Obama and the JCPOA. And I’m like, “This is why,”…

But I never quite understood why Trump ended it, unless it was really that the JCPOA was, at the same time, “Allow Iran to reenter the world and continue pursuing a nuclear weapon,” while saying, the entire time that they weren’t. And that’s unacceptable!

And unfortunately, it was that perspective was then put in the mouth of the amazingly odious Bibi Netanyahu. And if that was a core betrayal by the British of the Israelis, and then they orchestrated 10/7 and killed a whole bunch of f@cking civilians and took hostages and everything else, at some point, you just have to go, “Holy shit! They’re doing it again!” And Davos is lining up behind the Iranians.

And here’s the gig: And I also don’t think Iran is a monolith. I think there are many factions within Iran that want to negotiate in good faith. I absolutely believe this. I could even argue that. I can even argue that frigging Khamanei is the guy, actually…

But what if the IRGC is the one that’s actually pulling the strings, here? Because, if you look at the way the attacks rolled out on Thursday night, what did the Israelis, through all their propaganda, what did they emphasize? “We killed the negotiators.” That’s one that came out.

But they targeted all of these IRGC commanders. And they were attacking military targets. And they did all of that.

What if what we’re seeing, here is the factions within Iran that are at odds with each other? Just like we have factions within the United States that are at odds with each other, just like we have factions within Israel that are at odds with each other.

There are Zionists, and there are Israelis that don’t want any of this. What if, at the end of the day, what we’re trying to do is get rid of all of these people that are operating, and we have to out them?

It’s like we’ve watched Davos out itself over the last seven to 10 years, that you and I have been doing this together, and showing us, the world who they actually are.

What if this is just another one of those moments? And part of what we’re reacting to, here is our old frameworks, and our old understanding of things, and the reality isn’t what we thought it was?

Again, I always argued that, and I believed for a long time that Iran… “Look, if the Israelis weren’t going to act like a normal country, then Iran is not going to act like a normal country.” I get it.

If I were the leadership of Iran, and Israel was acting the way they were, yeah, I would do that. But I’ve heard it from too many people now that the entire region is done with the “Axis of Resistance”. They’re done with living under the threat of Iran doing violence in their countries and everything.

I’ve heard enough of this to know that I think everybody’s sick and tired of Israel’s bullshit, and I think they’re tired of Iran’s bullshit. OK?

And the Russian response to this has been very clear that they want this over and done with, and they, like Trump, want a negotiated settlement.

Because if they didn’t, then, they would have immediately pledged far more support. They’re not standing…

And I’ll be honest with you. The other thing, when you look at what’s happening in Ukraine, is it’s clear that Trump and Putin have, in effect, they’re saying, “Look, I have to deal with this Iran thing, but you’re going to deal with Ukraine, and we’re going to take all… We’re going to neuter all of this shit, all at once. You guys are going to get carte blanche to effectively do what you need to do in Ukraine.”

Because Trump is… Remember, the Biden aid… Pledged Aid ends on June 30th. The end of the fiscal year is June 30th. At that point, all the budgeted aid to Ukraine ends. Trump has not re-upped that. It’s not coming.

I mean, if he backs down on that, we’re f@cked. He’s a failed president, and I’m going to be breathing f@cking fire and digging a f@cking foxhole.

But if he holds serve on that, and the Russians keep pushing that way – because who wants the war? Who wants war, at this point? Davos. The European Union.

Alex Krainer: (Inaudible)

Tom Luongo: I don’t want war. You know that.

Alex Krainer: No, no. I’m saying “London”. London.

Tom Luongo: I thought you said “Tom Luongo”. I’m sorry. I’m sorry. I’m going down. No, literally, my left ear is nearly shot. Yeah, it’s nearly shot.

Chris Coverdale: We found you out, Tom. You’re controlled by MI6!

Tom Luongo: Seriously, dudes, I have been… Go look at the @ss-reaming I’m getting on Twitter, right now. The bots are out in such force!

They’re in such force, it’s crazy, as I’m trying to work through this, honestly. Maybe I’m being a little bit of a dick about it, because it’s Twitter, and that’s my persona on Twitter. But I’m also like, “Hey, man, rethink this through.”

I’m not saying… I don’t think I have this completely right, but I think there’s something here that we’re all missing, and we’re all being duped. They’re using our humanity against us. They’re using our strategic abilities against us. I think they’re very good at it. I don’t know.

Chris Coverdale: Alright. How about this, Tom? A simple explanation: Trump is pro-Zionist. He’s doing what he can to support. He’s either being captured, he’s being threatened, he’s compromised – who knows? – or he’s doing what’s really, really his heart’s desire.

He doesn’t want Iran to have nuclear weapons, because I’ve read stuff about how close he was to his uncle, and he was just so anti-nuclear. So he doesn’t want Iran to have nuclear weapons.

Israel’s already got them, so OK, fine. As long as Iran doesn’t have them, Israel’s not going to use them. And if Iran is weakened, then Israel doesn’t need to use them, and he’s supporting and empowering Israel to defeat Hezbollah, the Houthis, Hamas, and now Iran, and then we can have the Greater Israel Project.

Tom Luongo: I’m telling you, I think the Greater Israel Project is dead, if you want my honest opinion.

Chris Coverdale: I do. Please, why? They’re getting rid of Palestinians in West Bank. They’re destroying Gaza and making that prison smaller, and then shooting them, like fish in a barrel.

Tom Luongo: I know. It makes me so dirty to even think about, “This is the only way to deal with this f@cking problem. You have no idea how hard this is for me. You have no idea. You really don’t have any idea.

Chris Coverdale: No, no, I’m clear. Listen, I’m really clear about, we all have the same sympathies. We’re all anti-war. We don’t want anyone suffering, whether they’re Jews or Muslims or Christians or whatever, right? We don’t want conflict.

But human beings, just look at what Pol Pot did in Cambodia to his own people. Human beings have an incredible propensity for cruelty to their own. If they’ll do that to their own –

Tom Luongo: It’s a feral world. That’s the problem. At some point, when I thought about this the other night, and I meant this as I got to the end of it, I’m like, “In order to dare peace, you might have to threaten war,” and get everybody to the point where they go, “Holy f@cking sh¡t! Is this what we’re going to do?”

Chris Coverdale: It’s just such a dangerous game.

Tom Luongo: But you destroy Davos and you destroy the Old Israeli Project.

Chris Coverdale: Now, that’s the thing that doesn’t square, right, with Trump supporting Israel, because he is, in all other arenas, and from listening …

Tom Luongo: Or is he trying to allow for Israel to survive – but it’s not the Israel we’ve always known? I’ve always argued this, that the way out of this is to allow an Iran that is not pursuing this “Axis of Resistance” strategy, and an Israel that isn’t forcing … They’re each forced into the conflict with each other. They’re being forced into this ant shake, right? They’ve used Alex’s metaphor, right? It’s been building for 50 years, and it doesn’t …

In fact, I’m almost asking people, “All of the shit that we’ve dealt with up until 2015 in the JCPOA is important because it frames the background, but I think the story changed 10 years ago.”

I didn’t start seeing that until the other day. In times, I will cop to not having seen it, but I was around it. I was near it, but my own biases blinded me to it.

Again, this is not an endorsement of Israel, but frame it all from that perspective, and then, know that there are plenty of people in Israel that don’t want any of this, either.

Alex Krainer: Yeah, about 50% of them.

Tom Luongo: Well, I mean, after … But again, they’ve been propagandized… about what happened on 10/7, any more than we were propagandized after 9/11, Alex.

OK, I was run out of gun shops in North Florida for being a Libertarian after 9/11. OK? That’s how f@cking crazy people were.

You lived through the civil wars in Yugoslavia. You know how this is, and people lose their minds after an event like that, and they don’t care. OK, and that’s … You know what I mean? But bombs dropping on Tel Aviv gets everybody’s f@cking attention.

I want the Iranians to punch Israel in the mouth really f@cking hard, because that’s the only way we’re going to get to the other side of this. And I was a little worried that Iran’s response has been so weak, because it has been.

Chris Coverdale: OK, but now, Tom, Alex, just to make it clear, just reiterate, we’re all the same view. We don’t want people dying. We’re anti-war, right? And anti-colonialism.

And Tom, I’m not disagreeing with you, right? I’m curious. You know, let me look through the lens, because you’ve got a pretty good track record. But what about all of Trump’s posts on TRUTHSocial, “Iran has to surrender, we’ve got control of the ties?”

Alex Krainer: May I? Look, at this point, it’s important to ignore this, Rich. This is all PSYOPs. Trump is the world champion of PSYOPs. It’s best to just ignore it. But I think that I’ll take a stab of trying to work out the whole situation.

And I think it makes perfect sense, not only for the events of today, but it has a consistency going back centuries, OK?

So we know already that we’re looking at a conflict between the global empire and the whole rest of the world, essentially, which is why the conflict in Ukraine and the Middle East is basically the same thing.

In the Middle East, when the Soviet Union collapsed, you had the end of the Cold War, everybody was, “Oh, well, sh¡t, how do we position ourselves?”

The British made a conscious, deliberate decisions, that they will not become like a neutral island nation, minding their own business, that they will try to reassert themselves. As Douglas Heard, the foreign minister under John Major said, “We’re going to punch above our weight and we’re going to maintain that position and we’re in a good position to become a major global player again.”

They express the ambition to reestablish their hegemony east of Suez. So, they’re looking at the whole region, there. Remember, Israel is their colonial project. It serves the purpose of destabilizing the whole region there.

So they’re always at war with everybody else. They’re always picking a fight. “Oh, we have to take down Bashar al-Assad because danger, dangerous maniac, you know, blah, blah, blah.”

“Oh, Saddam Hussein is very dangerous. We have to take down Saddam Hussein.” And the West obediently does the work for him.

“Oh, Iranians, you know, the nuclear weapons.” And so now we’re discussing Iranian nuclear weapons.

The whole thing from start to finish is a colonial project.

The End Game for the Middle East is Iran. And they’ve been saying, “You have to go to Iran. But to go to Iran, you have to go through Damascus,” right?

“You have to take down Saddam Bashar al-Assad and then you can go to Iran,” right?

And so, Lo! and behold! the British and the Turks take down Bashar al-Assad. And then what, six months later, suddenly, the Iranian nuclear program becomes an “urgent matter”. And it’s all going in that direction.

And it’s the whole point of that game is to take them down, to regime-change them. And then, the whole region becomes a colony of the UK – primarily, UK – and France, exactly the same ones that partitioned the area under Sykes-Picot, which was slipping away from them. So they decided on this.

OK. And so, I understand why Trump backed out of the JCPOA, because he looked at the deal, and he was like, “What the Hell? We clean this up, we negotiate, we police it, and these European degenerates take the spoils? No deal!”

So that’s understandable but from the Iranian point of view, you’re negotiating with the Western Empire. You’re not differentiating, you know, like, “Oh, Trump is a Republican, and he wants to return the United States to its Republican tradition but Obama is a Globalist.”

As far as they’re concerned, they’re negotiating with the United States. And that means that being disarmed, having no deterrent, and showing all their cards, they’re making themselves vulnerable. So from their point of view, resisting and making themselves a hard nut to crack, makes complete and total and perfect sense.

And they’re entitled to it. And anybody reasonable, if they understood the issues will say, “Iran is fully in the right to be doing what they’re doing.”…

Israel is there as the beachhead of the Western Empire that wants to simply colonize the whole region.

Now, if you lose the Resistance, and they just say, like, “OK, we’re just going to let ourselves at the mercy of, you know, these European colonial powers.”

What does that mean? You become Congo, you become Angola, you become Niger, Burkina Faso, you become like India under the British rule.

Let me just give you a real taste of what that actually means. So India was under the British rule from 1757 until 1947, correct? About 200 years. In those 200 years, India suffered 30, 31 or 33 major famines. OK, in 200 years, up to 160 million dead.

Before the British rule in India, for over 2000 years, only 16 famines were recorded, OK? And since the British left India, not even a single one.

So you know, I know that correlation isn’t causation. But this, this is what you’re up against. If you eliminate resistance.

And what I get from the region, from the people that I that I’m in touch with from there, they’re not tired of the resistance. They want Israel gone. They want Western powers gone, United States included. They are supportive of the Resistance. They mourn the defeat of Hezbollah. They are collectively rooting and cheering for Ansarallah in Yemen, for the Iranians, for Iranian proxies, and for Hamas. They regard them as Jedis.

They want to resist. They want the Western power, the Hell out of there. So it’s, it’s not that complicated. And they don’t differentiate between the United States and Europeans.

I mean, we see the difference. But as far as they’re concerned, is the is the Evil Empire, and the Evil Empire is there as a predator, finding pretext, burrowing their way in, infiltrating, co-opting, sending spies, sending special forces, funding these separatist movement, these MEK-type alternative, and, and killing their people.

Iran is not attacking anybody. Iran is not conditioning whether the UK can have nuclear weapons, whether the United States can have a nuclear program. They’re not minding anybody else’s, but their business. But they are constantly on the defensive, because – and then, you know, we have 1996 Clean Break Doctrine.

And everything’s playing out exactly in accordance with the Clean Break Doctrine, right? And it was drafted by US Neocons, right? So as far as Iranians are concerned, the United States is not a friend. And so they have to be defensive.

And so, and so Iran is in the right to defend themselves, because maybe they will become, like the Congolese, they’re going to become slaves to the Western Empire. And maybe, they’re going to going to be depopulated with periodic famines.

And we in the West are going to sit here and say, “You know, these people are so corrupt, look, they can’t even get their agriculture in order. They probably deserve to all die, because look how inferior they are!” You know, typical colonialist behavior.

And the Brits and the French are dead-set on regaining their colonial dominance over the Middle East, over Africa, over South Asia. They want Russia, they want Ukraine, they want Eastern Europe, they want South America – all of it!

And so that is, you know, the nuclear program in Iran, and all the brouhaha about it, that is just a way to find pretext to trap the Iranians in doing something bad to say, like, “Oh, look, you bad Iranians, you have not showed us your this or that you’ve filled out.”

Tom Luongo: I know, of course. Alex, I’m in no way, manner, shape or form, am I disagreeing with any of that. I get all of it. I still believe all of that is true. I know what these f@cking Neocons will do. I know they all work. I mean, like, if I could look at f@cking Mark Rubin and all these people, I know what they are. They’re odious. I get it. I’m not, in no way, manner, shape, or form, am I arguing that point.

What I’m saying now is, these people are playing both sides, is what I’m saying. These same f@cking people, the British and the French are playing both sides.

And they’re allowing, they’re encouraging Iran to pursue a policy that they know will get, well, they’re doing it again, man. They’re doing it to us again!

This is, look, you want to invoke Star Wars? I’ll invoke Star Wars for you. How did Emperor Palpatine take over the world? He backed both the separatists and undermined the Jedi, all at the same time.

He got the Jedi to fight a f@cking war and…the peacekeepers to turn themselves into generals and corrupt the Jedi Code. Meanwhile, the entire time, he was behind the whole separatist movement.

I mean, as odious as the f@cking performances and the dialogue in those movies are, like, dude, this is explicitly clear. Like, go read a Grock summary of the plot of the prequel films, and you’ll see exactly what I’m talking about.

You’re absolutely right to invoke it, here. Davos is Emperor Palpatine, and they don’t give a shit. And they’ll use the Iranians, the right to defend themselves, and they’ll use the Israelis’ belief to have the right to defend themselves.

And they’ll control the people near the top to pursue policy that will ensure conflict. That’s what I’m arguing. And all you’ve got to do to ensure conflict is betray one of them and…the Israelis are the perfect f@cking scapegoat, because they’ve been so goddamn odious, up until this point. They’re the perfect f@cking Fall Guy. I mean, that’s what I’ve been getting at.

And that’s what I’m saying, here. And what if Trump sees through all of that, and Putin sees through all of that? And if you look at the way they’ve been acting, it’s so very obvious that they get it.

Trump wants to stop the war. He’s got people around him who want to stop the war in both places. He’s defied on all sides by traitors within the IC, the State Department, this one, that one, everything else. And he’s got a thin coalition, a thin majority in his legislature who gave him that. They stole 40 f@cking House seats, man! They stole six Senate seats!

Alex Krainer: I completely get all that, Tom and I don’t disagree. And I’ll go even a step further if you want. Because you know what? I understand the position that Trump is in.

I understand that maybe he’s playing this to the best of his ability, that he wants to stop the war, that he wants to eliminate even the causes of conflict there. And that he’s probably – well – obviously, he’s negotiating with the Iranians. He’s probably coordinating action with Vladimir Putin, possibly, probably with the Chinese, as well, either through Vladimir Putin or directly.

And I would say also, you know, something very mysterious happened last week. We found out that the Iranians obtained all these terabytes of detailed information about the Israeli nuclear program. And I thought, “OK, so maybe the Iranians are really, really capable with their intelligence work.”

Or maybe Trump’s people said, “Look, it’s going to get really ugly here. Please don’t take the rhetoric too hard. It’s just going to sound awful. Here’s a little gesture of goodwill.” And then they hand them the disk, you know, the data. So the Iranians understand, “OK, Trump’s not our enemy, but there’s a game being played and we’re going to play along.”

So what? Yesterday, they sent two aircraft of their officials to Oman. And then they, again, negotiated and discussed, I don’t know what exactly, but they discussed things with Steve Witkoff.

Where I would push back is I can’t see Israel as a Fall Guy. Israel is strictly British Empire’s beachhead in the Middle East, there to keep the region destabilized perpetually, and doing their job to a tee. Absolutely perfectly.

Tom Luongo: It is. It is. It is Occam’s Razor, Alex. It is Occam’s Razor. It is. I think there’s no argument.

Alex Krainer: On the other hand, the Iranians, they don’t need inducement by anybody from the outside to do what they do.

Because I think that their strategy and their positioning is perfectly consistent with their own priorities. You know, they need to defend their regime, they need to not become a colony of the Western Empire. And the same was true for Bashar al-Assad.

And, you know, it was necessary to take down his regime. He wasn’t open to being played on both sides. So they play him a little bit.

You know, they tried to play him by saying like, hey, you know, “Qatar gas to Syria, to Israel and Turkey. How about it? And we run it and it’s our show.” And he said, “No.”

And that’s when they said, “That’s the end of him.”

Tom Luongo: And that’s when they said like, OK, that’s the end of him. Right. Again, what I’ve been, you know, again, there’s a part of this, a part of this story, especially about Syria, as I said earlier, you know, there’s a, I can see the Turks under Erdogan being given control over Syria, in order to thwart Greater Israel. OK.

What I can say. But at the same time, can also see Erdogan saying, “Yeah, you know what?” And deal with Iran as well. OK.

I think that, and I’m making a very cynical read on this. And I know I’m making a very cynical read on this, because this may be the best we can get out of this, OK?

The Russians’ perspective on this has been very weird. And the other thing that has altered my perception on this in the last week was just how good the Israeli execution of the initial attack was.

I was at a Bitcoin conference in Tampa last weekend. So I was, I don’t remember quite when I had this conversation with, I think it was late Friday afternoon. And he said, he said to me, he’s like, “Look, Iran has to like take out Israel’s, you know, air fueling capabilities, their ammo dumps, their, their fuel dumps and everything else, if they want to have a chance here. Otherwise, they’re in serious, serious, serious trouble.”

Like then, we’ve all been shocked by how little, in effect the response has been. Well, it’s not over yet.

But what I keep saying is they shot a hundred missiles on Friday night or Thursday on Friday, then they shot 20 or 50, and then they shot 20. And then, last night they shot five. Like, it doesn’t matter how many missiles they have. They don’t have any launchers. If the launchers have been taken out, they can only, you know, it’s having 20,000 rounds of ammo and only five guns. That’s unfortunately what it feels like. I’d be wrong.

It may have a lot more, OK. I don’t know…Like I said, I was having that conversation with Larry Johnson. And it’s very, to me, this looks like a classic Dabogean tactic [?] to attempt to attack, to take Trump off the board, so they can do the big frigging colonialist purge.

That’s what I think is the ultimate target, here. And I would love nothing more than to see Iran give up their nuclear program and Israel to be forced to give up theirs, as well.

That’s what, that’s what I mean, when I say the Grand Bargain in the Middle East, with the Russians and the Americans being the guarantors. That’s not going to happen.

And then, the way you keep the British and the French from coming back in to the region is of course, you bankrupt them at home and then you take the war financial.

That’s been my framework for years. And the big question is, in everybody’s mind, is what deals that the Iranians make in their pursuit of their defensive strategy that doesn’t paint them in a, the “Perfect Victim” light?

I am not here to make any statements about that. What I’m here to do is to very dispassionately look back and go, “Anybody who’s trying to tell me that you’re the Perfect Victim and you’re the Perfect Villain, you’re the Perfect Hero, f@ck you! It’s all gray. You’re all mob bosses. No, sorry, not buying it.”

That’s the world I’m, that’s the position I’m taking, because that one, most likely has the most truth in it. One may be more of a victim than the other, and one may be more of a villain than the other, but no one’s, you know what I mean? Like that’s the way I look at it, man.

Alex Krainer: I don’t look at it that way, Tom. The British and the Europeans have been slaughtering and depopulating people around the world for more than two centuries.

Tom Luongo: Those are the only Perfect Villains in the story.

Alex Krainer: For more than five centuries.

Tom Luongo: I know.

Alex Krainer: Iranians haven’t attacked anybody in 300 years. You know, they’re not the same. The Russians never colonized anywhere.

Tom Luongo:I never said that, Alex.

Alex Krainer: Yeah, I know, but they’re not the same, so it’s not all gray. There’s really something black on the side of the people who are the sponsors of the Israeli State.

Tom Luongo: OK, fair. I’m talking about the actual people who are in the fight. The Americans, the Russians, the Israelis, and the Iranians. I’m not talking about the one shaking the f@cking jar. We know those f@cking people are evil.

Alex Krainer: Oh, well, yeah, but I think that’s the only thing that’s relevant. The fact that the red ants and the black ants are being nasty to one another, that’s downstream from these people shaking the jar.

Tom Luongo: Yes, yes. All I’m trying to do is put a finer picture on it in order to lead us to good outcomes, because right now, everybody’s throwing their weight, going, “Trump’s a f@cking Zionist, and he’s betraying MAGA, and he’s doing this.”

F@ck off. And I just don’t want anybody to be confused about this. There are plenty of Iranians who don’t want a nuclear weapon. I think there’s plenty of Iranians in power who don’t want a nuclear weapon. I also think there are plenty of Israelis who don’t want what Netanyahu’s doing.

But you look at the situation. I want Iran to survive, and I’ll be honest with you. Here’s interesting point –

Alex Krainer: What do you mean you want Iran to survive? They’ve been there for 5,000 years!

Tom Luongo: I don’t want anybody wiped off the face of the f@cking planet. I want Iran to come into the world. What I was about to say is this:

One of the things that was an interesting tell, and something that was lost in all of this, as much as I f@cking hate this guy, Netanyahu’s initial statement after the attack. Did you watch it? After which attack? The first attack on Thursday. When Netanyahu from Greece or the Israeli attacking Iran on Thursday night, a week ago Thursday. Did you watch it?

Alex Krainer: Sure. Sure. Yeah.

Tom Luongo: OK. I watched it, and I noticed something that wasn’t ever there before, which is Netanyahu actually saying to the Iranian people, “Look, you can be a great people, blah, blah, blah, blah.” He was actually offering a Fig Leaf [Olive Branch?] to the Iranian people as opposed to his normal, “They’re evil, they’re this.”

That tells me that someone’s holding his strings. I think those strings are being held by Trump. I think Trump has given him just enough leash to go do what Trump wants him to do, so that we can get to the next phase of this.

That’s what I think. Netanyahu never, ever said that before. Ever!

Alex Krainer: What I heard in that speech is he’s trying to butter-up the great, proud Iranian people to overthrow the regime.

Tom Luongo: I know. I know. That is the uncynical leap.

Alex Krainer: Same strategy of regime change. It has nothing to do with nuclear this or that. All that is bullsh¡t. The end goal is regime change, and they want to rouse the Iranian people to overthrow their regime. I heard nothing good in his speech, even remotely.

Tom Luongo: Well, I’m looking for the hope, dude, because you’re right. Yeah, I know. I’m looking for hope that someone has actually got him on a leash.

Alex Krainer: Somebody’s got him on the leash, that’s for sure, but the question is whether it’s Trump. I would look to Sir Richard Moore. I would look MI6, I would look to the Undersecretary, Permanent Undersecretary of the Foreign Office. I would look to the Bank of England. That’s where I would look to. 100% they have him on the leash.

But they are Satanic, degenerate, genocidal maniacs. So whatever they say, even if it sounds nice and fluffy, I don’t trust it. If they tell me that fluffy bunny rabbits are nice, I would not trust them.

Tom Luongo: Alex, what I’m asking you to do, and I know you’re resisting this, and that’s fine, which is that that may not actually be completely true here; that the game itself has actually turned enough that Netanyahu –

Alex Krainer: I know what you’re saying, and I agree. I know what you’re saying, and I agree. I think it has changed. I’m just talking about the game of the last –

Tom Luongo: 500 years.

Alex Krainer: With respect to Israel, let’s call it 100.

Tom Luongo: Yeah, I agree.

Alex Krainer: What I’m saying is – the Balfour Declaration starts even before that, but let’s call it –

Tom Luongo: What I’m about to say is going to sound like, “Oh! It’s a PSYOP, it’s 4D chess!” That’s not what I’m saying. What I’m saying is this, is that if, in the existential moment, Israel has to choose sides, after they’ve been betrayed by the people who put them in the position that they’re in, that even a guy like Netanyahu, at that moment may have to say, “You know what? Davos is weak! All of their promises don’t matter!”

If they betrayed Israel – their project – in order to start this process, where we are today, then I can see a master psychopath politician like Netanyahu throwing in with Trump.

The proof of that argument – and we don’t have that proof yet – and I’m not saying that that argument is correct. I’m not saying anything. What I’m saying is the proof of that argument is if we do not see him push for regime change, along with Trump, and if everybody else pushes for regime change; the Shah’s son, Pahlavi, coming, or grandson coming, who they’re out there, parading in front of us every day, and they were in our space the other night telling us, “This is the guy everybody wants.”

I saw it, and then I heard, and then I had like five, 15 people come out of the woodwork. “Nah, that guy is clearly for them!” So I’m watching this, and I’m like, I’m wondering. I think we might be both right, in the end.

Alex Krainer: Here’s how I see it, Tom. The United States is the blunt force in this world. They are the provider of weapons, security guarantees, aircraft, bombs, all of these things.

So to that extent, the United States holds the strings, and Netanyahu obviously has to respond to Trump, but Netanyahu is, you know how we said that this is the same conflict as in Ukraine? Same thing. Zelenskyy needs Trump for bombs, and aircraft, and military support, and intelligence support, and ammunitions, and all of this, but you notice, Zelenskyy has been antagonizing Trump since the start, because he already signed over the family silverware of Ukraine to the Brits.

Same thing in the Middle East. They still want Trump to be the blunt force to kick everybody’s ass and make them submit, but they want all of the wealth of the Middle East to go to the degenerate, retarded, hereditary, oligarchic families of Europe and Great Britain.

So obviously, this is where the story breaks, but Netanyahu still needs the weapons and the protection from the United States, which is why you have ultimately, actually, the real rift, which is between the United States and Europe.

And to my mind, Davos is nothing but a debating society, produced and orchestrated by the City of London. And you can see, like this last Davos, you can go and you can see the interview between Tony Blair and Al Shibani, I think, the foreign minister of Syria, which is one of the guys that, he went from being a founder of Al-Qaeda in Syria to being the foreign minister. They made it look nice. They put a suit on him. And then, Tony Blair interviews him at Davos.

But who is Tony Blair? Tony Blair has been in charge of that whole thing from the time he was the Prime Minister. And he’s still in charge of the whole thing, because all these terrorists have been transformed from being terrorists to being a politician, now by Tony Blair’s former chief of staff, Jonathan Powell. And Jonathan Powell then puts them in a suit, trains them what to say and how to say it, and then sends them to Davos, where Tony Blair interviews them.

And then, you know, they come across as these really nice, soft guys, completely devoted to “democracy” and “human rights”; talk about “empowering women”.

And then, you know, once the show is over, the lights are out, and they go back to their business. Then they conduct a mass slaughter of Alawites across Syria. Same shit.

But that string of events tells you that it’s the City of London that’s doing it, and that Tony Blair is the equestrian in charge of that project.

They need Trump, they need the United States for the aircraft, for the satellites, for the bombs, for the missiles, for the anti-aircraft defense, and all this.

But the whole intelligence work, the secret diplomacy, the dirty games, with financing terrorists and getting them to slaughter a whole bunch of people there, that’s all coming out of London.

Tom Luongo: Oh, I know. I know.

Alex Krainer: In Ukraine? Same shit in the Middle East.

Tom Luongo: Exactly. I agree. I agree 100%, Alex. I agree. I know. You’re not ever getting any argument at me about that. But again, I’m going to continue to pursue a slightly new tack, not because it has to be considered, because the game is changing, and the rules are changing, and the relationships are changing.

It may just be that all we’re seeing, here is the flowering of all the things that you and I have been talking about: The growing relationship between Trump and Putin, and the change of the world from the center being Europe to the center of the world being the Pacific Ocean, and yada, yada, yada.

Then along the way, in order to get that, unfortunately, the native populations have to actually pay in blood. That’s, unfortunately, the way humans are wired. We all wish this just ends with no bloodshed. We all wish that it ends, but it doesn’t.

Davos is a metaphor. I think “Evil Corp Central” is the better way of looking at it. Pick a new term. I don’t really care. But Davos was a good term in 2017. Today, maybe Evil Corp Central is better, because it’s less geographic.

But you look at what’s happening. Everybody who wants the war is north of the Mediterranean. And the Mediterranean states are all being fortified by Trump and attacked by Europe, while we now have this thing touch off.

All I’m saying, all I’ve been trying to elucidate, here is that it could easily be that there are factions in Iran’s political and military hierarchy that are also working for these f@cking people [the Globalists].

That’s what I’ve been saying. They’re betraying their own people, as well as everybody else. That’s a harder narrative to accept, but it may actually be true.

It may be. Yes. Because it actually furthers their f@cking evil goddamn plans. Only reason I would even consider it, man. Only reason.

Alex Krainer: You will have a Fifth Column in Russia. You’ll have a Fifth Column in Iran. You’ll have a Fifth Column in China. Obviously, that exists.

But in those regimes, you have Vladimir Putin on top, who defines policy. You have Ali Khamenei on top, who defines policy. You have Xi Jinping on top, who defines policy. Not by themselves, in isolation. They have their cabinet. They have their boards of advisors for this and for that, obviously. But then, there at the top of the pyramid, you form a consensus. “This is the strategy. This is what we’re pursuing. This is what we’re doing.”

The fact that the Fifth Column is there doesn’t have the same impact as it does in our democracies, where we’re all over the place, and we have no idea who’s in charge, because it’s that way by design.

And then, I’ll also take exception to that “we’re wired this way”. I don’t think we’re necessarily wired this way. Since 1946 until now, 80% of all wars in the world have been initiated by the United States. Since that same period, the UK has been engaged in at least 80, 83, 84, 85 military conflicts around the world.

You take those two out, and the United States has taken this role only because it has been infiltrated and co-opted by the British Empire. If you take that element out, if you manage to quarantine the Empire, the British action in the world, I bet you 90% of all the problems in the world would just dissipate, be gone. And then, people would be solving mutual conflicts in a completely different way.

They said, “Well, sh¡t, this is mine!” “No, it’s mine!” “OK, well, let’s half it.”

Tom Luongo: You can see the way that Trump has set up the Middle East, that he did more when he went to the Middle East and set up all those deals in 10 days than had been done in 10 years. It’s very clear. And it’s the same thing like SPIEF, the St Petersburg Economic International Forum, is going on next week.

As a matter of fact, I’ve had to blow-off Sputnik. They’ve been asking me for an interview to talk about that. And I look at SPIEF as one of those things every year that is a node of potential stability, because it’s going to stitch people together through economics and trade. I believe in all of that. I know Trump believes in all that. It’s very obvious that he believes in all of that.

And yeah, this is where I am. And I’ll be honest with you. I think that there are a lot of Israelis that would like the exact same thing for their country. I do. I don’t think that the Israeli people are any more or less evil or bloodthirsty or anything else. There’s a cartoon version of that. There’s a cartoon American in the world, and there’s a cartoon Russian in the world, and there’s a cartoon…

The British people are getting f@cked, left and right. The English people, sorry, not British, the English people, the Scots, the Irish, they’re all getting fucked by what they’re doing over at 10 Downing Street. Same thing with the French people and the Germans and everybody else.

They’re all being played. They’re all being whipped-up. What I mean by “they’re wired” is that we’re wired to respond to an aggression against us and an attack on our homeland.

So I don’t, and I never have blamed the Iranians for many of the things that they’ve done, in their strategy. I am beginning to question whether or not Khamenei at the top of Iranian society has as good a control over his pyramid as the other people you mentioned.

Because clearly Netanyahu doesn’t have that level of control over Israel. Likud can get at best 25 to 30%, but at the same time, the Israeli people understand that in order for them to survive, they have to make the Faustian Bargain to put him in power because he’s the only one who can actually do the things necessary to deal with what they perceive as the threats to their existence.

And again, that’s it. And I know that Israel, itself is a pawn in the game. I get it. I’m not arguing that point. I’m just trying to add a little bit of nuance to all of this. Because it’s in that 5% of nuance or 10% nuance that we haven’t been talking about, that I think that’s where all of this, where the fulcrum are to get us out the other side. It’s a needle that we have to thread. That’s all I’m arguing.

Otherwise, you and I completely agree.

Alex Krainer: I think that we almost completely agree. I think we’re very close to completely agreeing. I just, you know, I think that the whole story starts with European colonialism. Iranians never asked for that, you know, and it’s there at their doorstep. So, if they do this or that questionable vis-à-vis the colonialists, well, they’ve been provoked into that situation.

You know, like imagine if somebody came to the border of the United States and then started – well, actually, you don’t have to imagine it. That’s actually happening.

Tom Luongo: It is happening!

Alex Krainer: You know, and so now you could tear Trump apart, because he’s, you know, sending these people back who have lived there and who are now, you know, part of the American system and they lived there for so many years.

“Well, hey, look, you came there illegally. What the Hell? You know, what are we supposed to do, not enforce our laws?”

So, you know, you could always take somebody and then, you know, pick them apart, because something they’ve done is maybe questionable or maybe it’s abrasive or rough or nasty, but they’ve been put into that situation.

You know, if you didn’t have all these illegals forcing their way, you know, because George Soros gave them these brochures, you’re going to get a job and a house and a car and everything’s going to be amazing for you. If that didn’t happen, the United States wouldn’t have to do any of this shit that they’re forced to do now.

Same thing for Iran. You know, if they were not being besieged by the Empire nonstop, they wouldn’t have to do a lot of the things that they’re doing, which we might say like, “Hey, you know, that was not very nice.”

Tom Luongo: Oh, I agree. And I’m just saying that I think we, at a certain level need to understand that that is part of the Israeli Zeitgeist, as well. Oh, and I know that’s hard.

Alex Krainer:Israelis are, look, for me, 85% of them or something, pretty much want the Palestinians gone, right? I think, OK, just to be clear about this, I don’t think that’s a Jewish thing, because if you read the history of settler colonialism, it’s always the same shit. It’s extremely cruel.

It’s extremely bloody and atrocious. The French in Algeria and other African countries, the British in China, in India and across Africa, the Germans in Africa, the Belgians in the Congo, the Spaniards in South America, the Japanese…

Tom Luongo: The Americans across the American, the native populations in the West.

Alex Krainer: So this is nothing to do with Jews. But I think that at present, the Israeli Jews are under a thick barrage of Mass Formation Psychosis, which is being deliberately-induced and forced on them. And, you know, they are those really, really shitty, nasty red ants right now, which means that in one hand, you can understand them. But I mean, none of it was meant to happen.

And it’s been that way since 1948. And oh, I’ll just throw this in there: So I have a friend whose family was in Auschwitz or Treblinka, one of these places. And then, when they got liberated, when the Soviets let them out of the camps, they were not exactly let out of the camps. They were transferred to a different camp under the control of the who? Nigerians? The Inuit? The Maori? The British, as it happens.

And so he told me that, you know, my family, they wanted to go to the United States, they wanted to go to Canada or Australia, they wanted to go that nobody, nobody wanted to go to the Middle East. So the British held them there. And they were let go on condition that they go to the Middle East, they were kind of coerced to go to the Middle East, because they had the agenda of seeding that region with the Jewish race to create Israel, in order to cement their hegemony of the Middle East.

So that so now, you know, if Hamas do something bad, because they are resisting the Occupation, well, sh¡t, that’s way, way, way downstream from the British gross interference in the region’s policy and ethnic makeup and social makeup and all of those things. Anyway, I’m done. It’s –

Tom Luongo: I know I’m with you on all of that. And putting that putting that on the table is absolutely, is actually absolutely fair. It’s absolutely fair. OK, so no, never, never, never think I think otherwise, when I present the challenges like this, I’m doing so from a purely strategic and unemotional perspective.

And I hate to have to do it. And I hate to have to be the guy that puts that on the table, OK, sometimes, and that’s what I’m saying.

And, and their goal is to always make us all dirty. Their goal is to make everybody dirty. They want to they want to turn Trump into the Villain. “You want to either die here or you live just long enough to be a Villain,” right? – Dark Knight. It’s a profound statement.

But at the same time, another profound statement, and I will reiterate what I said, up in the cornerstone: Your focus determines your reality. And so be aware of that, shift your focus, test your hypotheses, test your understanding and your knowledge, question yourself and what your own biases, and then ask yourself, “Does it all still fit?”

And since we’re all working with imperfect information, under multiple layers of f@cking psychological operations, intended to drive us all insane, the only way you remain sane is to constantly do that. And it’s exhausting. And we’re going to get stuff wrong.

Alex Krainer: Yeah, of course, of course.

Tom Luongo: And you know, like I said, the top of the show, I wish I had gone with my initial instinct on 10/7, that it was f@cking MI6 operation…because if I had done that, I would have gone all the way downstream and I would have gone, “Oh, and 18 months from now, the Europeans are going to turn to Iran as their saviors. And Israel is going to – I could see this all play out, that way. From that perspective.

Once I once I did that, I stopped f@cking around and listened to my hindbrain, which told me this is what was going on. And so, I’m willing to cop to that, as well. And I could have actually prepped this wouldn’t feel like such a whiplash, coming from me. Because I would have been prepping this for a long time.

And so, you know, fair cop, man, we all get a little wrong. I know, Rich, you need to go.

Chris Coverdale: I canceled the other appointment but it is coming up to the two-hour mark. There’s no stopping you, Tom, when you get going, right?

Tom Luongo: I’m so sorry!

Alex Krainer: At least, it’s not about football or women or something.

Tom Luongo: I want to make a repeat of the Stanley Cup, you know –

Chris Coverdale: We’re not going to do that. We’re not going to do that.

Tom Luongo: I’m sorry.

Chris Coverdale: I do want to say this, like at a fractal level, you know, my job as a social worker is look and see what’s going on in the household. And I find things that are unpleasant doesn’t mean I like it or agree with it, but I’ve got to work out what’s the motivation between the different players and who’s going to get hurt. And that doesn’t, in any way mean that I agree with it or like what’s going on. And that’s what I hear and what you’re saying, Tom.

Tom Luongo: You know, and, we’re dealing with family system stuff that goes back 500 years. Maybe 1,000 years.

Chris Coverdale: Maybe you’re right. Maybe you’re partially right. Time will tell. And all there is for us to do is to keep standing for peace.

If you’re in the UK, bit.ly/makewarhistory. There’s a, if I can, there is a little story with that, with HMRC wrote to me and they said, they’re going to take the money from my salary. They’re going to change my tax code.

And I wrote back to them and I said, “No, you’re not. You can’t do that. Bill of Rights, the law due to due process, which is derived from the Magna Carta, International Criminal Court Act, the Recognition of Trust Act, the Terrorism Act, your administrative processes don’t get to overrule those laws and statutes. Go away!”

So, see what happens now! So bit.ly/makewarhistory.

All right, go check that out in the UK, so we can make war history and then spend our money on more useful things, rather than the killing of other people in foreign lands.

Alex Krainer: Yes. What Rich just said is a deadly serious and very important initiative. It’s not a gimmick. And so, if somebody thought it was a gimmick, no, really go check it out.

Tom Luongo: And one last point on what Rich just said, the path to what I am arguing here is what everybody’s arguing. Wouldn’t it be a nicer world if we didn’t all have to spend all our time and energy and effort – be it the Iranian, Israeli, American or anybody else – spending all this money and weapons, all this money and time and energy and effort on making f@cking weapons of war as opposed to making things that are productive. So we’ve got all this, we’ve got all this lovely technology that this f@cking that these endless conflicts have created.

Let’s now put them to productive, civilian use and let’s – I want my f@cking flying cars!

Chris Coverdale: Fabulous. OK.

Alex Krainer: The Chinese are building them.

Tom Luongo: I know they are!

Links in the description below for Tom and Alex. Go check them out.

Follow them on X and look forward to seeing you all again in a few weeks. Thank you, guys.

Alex Krainer: All right, guys. This was all fire and brimstone.

Chris Coverdale: It was quite, it was quite heated. It was good.

Thank you. Thank you. Take care, guys.